dog with bone cancer

[cathywelch]

My sister just phoned me with news that her grey Nat has bone cancer and doesn't have long left. She has only had him about 11 months. He was an elderly ex racer of 10 and placed back into kennels again.
She has been given the option of putting him to sleep now as he is in pain or having his leg amputated to give him maybe 3 pain free months more (no guarantees).
My feelings are not to put him through this but would apreciate others opinions.
I have told her that at least he will have his last days in a loving home and although this is a short time he could have been in the kennels all this time. He is a very loving dog, a real gentle giant and will be missed lots

[lilypie]

oh what an awfully sad situation , my own personal view is that i wouldnt put one of my hounds through a big op for an extra couple of months. can his pain be managed with medication if not then it would be kindest although heartbreaking to consider putting hime to sleep hugs to you all its an awful sitauation to be in

[cathywelch]

He is on pain killers but not enough to keep it under control. The lump only came up a couple of weeks ago and it is a very agressive form.
If it was my girl and she were 11 I couldn't put her through it.

[samburns]

Oh no I'm so sorry for Nat and your sister, its a horrid horrid disease  


We have had two greyhounds diagnosed with bone cancer   We had only had our first greyhound lad Jazz for nine months, aged 7, when he was diagnosed.  We were told that he had two tumours, one in his hip, and that the kindest thing would be to let him go while still under GA after he was x-ray'd because they said it was inoperable.  We knew nothing about bone cancer then and followed that advice.  It may have been the only option for him, I know he was in a lot of pain when we took him to the vets but I still feel a sense of sadness and frustration that I didn't know enough to ask more questions at the time to be satisfied it was absolutely the right thing to do. 


Last year our greyhound Dickie, aged 9, was diagnosed with bone cancer.  We know in his case the tumour was not as aggressive as they often are as it took 5 months from the first symptoms to get a diagnosis.  Thanks to the tremendous support and advice from Lisa and other Gappers who have so much experience sadly with this cancer, we opted for amputation and chemotherapy.  Dickie is still with us and a very happy greyhound nearly a year later


I do remember thinking how great it would be to have a crystal ball and to know how long taking the surgical route would give him   However, after only two weeks post-op, I knew it was the right decision and that every single day was worth what he went through with the surgery - he was literally running around and happy again, doing all the things he enjoyed without the pain of the tumour.  He healed very quickly and flew through the chemo


I think it really comes down to individual dogs and how their owners will cope   10 is not young, but many dogs are still very active and healthy at that age.  The surgery may only give Nat 3 months, it may give him much longer.  Some dogs fare better some less, the surgery involves some risks of itself and some dogs adjust to three legs quicker than others. 

The main thing is for the vet to xray the chest, the cancer often spreads to the lungs if not caught quickly enough and if there are already tumours in the lungs then surgery is unlikely to give Nat very long, I think most vets would advise against amputation if that were the case


One thing that sticks in my mind discussing our options with Lisa was how I felt PTS was the kindest thing because Dickie was in so much pain.  Its hard to make decisions when you're faced with a dog in so much pain   Even with pain meds the tumours are extremely painful and the pain is extremely difficult to manage   But as Lisa said to me, once the tumour is gone, the pain is gone too - yes the surgery of itself causes some pain, in Dickie's case some bruising and swelling, but it was nothing compared to the pain of the tumour and I think he was off pain meds altogether within about 3 weeks of the surgery  

I know what I'm saying is much influenced by the fact we still have Dickie here, still very much enjoying life.....but I know there are other Gappers whose greyhounds and lurchers have lived well beyond a year post op, over two years too   I know no vet ever wants to get someone's hopes up about how long surgery + chemo might give but there is also room often for optimism


Whatever your sister decides to do for Nat, it is wonderful that she gave an older grey a home and I'm sure these last 11 months have been the very best of his life  My thoughts are with them both

If she would like a chat I'll PM you my number.

Sam x

[samburns]

Apr 10, 2013 14:50:10 GMT -5 cathywelch said:

He is on pain killers but not enough to keep it under control. The lump only came up a couple of weeks ago and it is a very agressive form.
If it was my girl and she were 11 I couldn't put her through it.

Hi, I cross-posted and didn't see your above post  


As I said Dickie's cancer we presume was not aggressive, there was never any lump - I don't know how effective amputation and chemo is when it is so aggressive.  Its a truly evil disease

[cathywelch]

Sam,
was it a front or rear leg amputation? My thoughts were for a front leg ( it is in his shoulder ) that it would be difficult to get around as with arthritis, dogs tend to put more weight on their front legs to take pressure of the back end, so it would be more difficult especially for a long legged dog.
Your advice is very helpful. As it has only been a couple of weeks they have said it is very agresssive. What are the side effects of the chemo for dogs and how long would it last? They have said at the most it would only give him 3 months with the chemo.
Is this a common problem in greys then?

[samburns]

Bone cancer tends to affect long boned/ large dogs, so yes sadly it is not uncommon in greyhounds/lurchers (there is some speculation also with greys that it is genetic - some particular greyhound lines seem to be worse affected - and also possibly related to previous traumas to the bone - again a link to racing ) but other breeds like great danes, GSDs, boxers and labs are also quite prone to it  


Yes Dickie had a front leg amputated, the tumour was in the humerus bone in the shoulder area.  One of the consultants who checked him pre-op did a full body check to ensure his body, particularly his back legs could cope with it.  Actually he does have some problems in his lower back but he copes amazingly well.  Another thing Lisa said to me - sorry just came back to me - is that he was 'already' coping just fine on three legs before the op, he was lame anyway on the one with the tumour.  You're right, the weight burden is definitely more to the front - some vets are particularly anti front leg amputations in greys, but Dickie is a big and very long lad (33" long!) and weighed around 36kg I think when he had the op.  It took time for him to build muscle where he needed it but he compensated naturally immediately - the front leg takes a more central position and the back legs adjust so that they stand with one slightly forward to form a 'tripod' balance.  He built his stamina up at his own rate, telling us how much he could cope with (which was much much quicker than we would have thought possible) - he does love his walks though


There are different chemo options.  The one Dickie had was given over four or five courses, the first one was about 5/6 weeks post op, the sessions lasted about an hour and the rest were at monthly intervals.  He was a little off his food after the fist one (we didn't give him the anti-sickness tablets though because he was never sick and quickly got his appetite back), so just mildly off-colour for half a day after the chemo

[cathywelch]

Thanks Sam. This has been very helpful. I will ring my sister and let her know what has been said. It is good to get advice from someone who has been through this. I will ask her if she would like a chat with you. Thanks for the offer. x

[andywillow]

So sorry to hear about your sister dog No experience but I do think its down to how well and fit the dog is at the moment. Good thoughts for whatever your sister decides to do for her boy

[gilli176]

I agree with Sam Dizzy is 22 months post amp and diagnosis. I only doubted the decision to amputate for about a week every time she runs and smiles I know we made the right choice for her. However its not the same for all dogs.

[laura2001]

Grady, our bridge boy, had bone cancer. The lump appeared literally overnight in his wrist. It took a couple of weeks for diagnosis, and it hadn't spread to his lungs, but we were told he would have 3 months at most. Amputation wasn't even offered as an option by my then vet. We managed his pain really well with metacam. When we went back for more pain relief and metacam, the vets were very surprised he was still with us and still enjoying life. We had to let him go 9 months after diagnosis after he had a stroke.

Looking back, I don't think we would have gone down the amputation route, as Grady was 12, a big dog and I don't think he would have coped with 3 legs. He lived life to the full, and we tailored walks around him to make sure he didn't over do it. He remained a very happy boy until his stroke. That doesn't mean I would never amputate, if any of my dogs get bone cancer - I think you have to look at each case individually and decide what is best for your dog and you.

My heart goes out to your sister, it's such a horrible disease, and I hope she realises she has given Nat a wonderful life, no matter for how long.

[allthehounds]

Hi, I'm really sorry to hear about your sister's dog, she must be heartbroken. We've lost two greyhounds to bone cancer and both at only 7 years old. We didn't amputate the first time and tried to keep Ringo comfortable for as long as possible with pain killers etc but he was in so much pain and stopped eating and couldn't sleep at night that we knew we had to let him go. He was only with us 18 months and was just starting to love life after coming off the track so it was heartbreaking to have to say goodbye so soon.

The second time was with our girl Mou-Mou who was diagnosed with bone cancer in her front left wrist. She was the complete opposite to Ringo in that she was always full of energy and never let anything faze her so we decided to amputate her leg followed by chemo. She came home from the vet after the surgery two days later and actually ran towards us, we were amazed as we'd expected to have to carry her! We had a few issues with the wound healing and the first two weeks were really rough on us all as she had some phantom pain and would start screaming the house down in the middle of the night which was scary to say the least! Once she recovered though there was no stopping her and she was as fast on three legs as she was on four. The chemo didn't bother her at all and our vet was amazed at how well she was doing but then just before her final session of chemo she became paralysed almost overnight in her hind end and couldn't move about by herself at all. X-rays showed the cancer had come back and in her spine this time so on the day of her final chemo session we ended up letting her go instead. That was just over a year ago and I still cry now when I remember that awful day.

I think that if the dog was fit enough then no matter what age I'd probably opt for surgery again as that's the only sure fire way to remove the pain of bone cancer but I'm not sure I'd do the chemo again because although without it Mou might have left us sooner, by having it she only survived 6 months post amputation. I hope your sister comes to a decision she's happy with because that's the most important thing. Whatever road she goes down needs to be one she feels comfortable with because dealing with bone cancer is not easy and her emotions are probably all over the place, I know mine were!! Sending lots of hugs to her and Nat and I'm keeping them both in my thoughts. Sian.

[cathywelch]

Thanks for all the kind replies. With hearing other experiences and a long chat with her vet she is going to go ahead with amputation. If it is unsucessful she always has the other option. He is booked in for Monday morning.

I had no idea about this awful disease. I for one will be checking Pepper much more thoroughly on a regular basis. x

[samburns]

Oh gosh I'll have everything crossed here for Nat on Monday and throughout his recovery from the op   Please pass on my thoughts to your sister   Let us know how everything goes. 

We were very lucky to receive a huge amount of advice and support from folks here whose dogs have had amputations (not all bone cancer related) it is a massive op and you've really no idea what to expect afterwards so please let your sister know we are all here for her too  

[sassbu]

This forum truly is an amazing place for a wealth of advice and experiences, if ever this was an example of that wishing Nat and your family all the very best thoughts for Monday bless him, will be keeping an eye out for updates