Annual boosters after chemo?

[samburns]

Dickie is due for his annual boosters. Does anyone happen to know whether this is an issue after completing a course of chemo? We will of course discuss with the vet in due course but was just wondering?

Thanks, Sam x

[Nettie]

I don't know Sam although all datasheets say the dog should be healthy before administering vaccinations, is Dickie's immune system compromised at all, if it is I, personally, would wait. When did he last have his full vaccinations and which manufacturer?

[kizzeysmum]

When my Jimmy was on chemo and his vaccinations were due, I was advised not to have them done. His immune system was compromised at the time.

I sourced advice from two vets, a vet cancer specialist and the vaccination companies themselves and they all advised against it.

[samburns]

I'm glad I've asked, it sounds like we should probably do our own research before speaking to our vet....

He had his last boosters 12 months ago - I don't know who the manufacturer is.

Thanks for that info Rose Marie Dickie had his last course of chemo at the end of last month, I've no idea how long his immunity is, or is likely to be, compromised for....

I think I might need to speak to the oncologist at AHT

[mrhoads]

Hi Sam,

I don't know for dogs.

My limited experience in people is that if the immune system is seriously compromised enough from chemo, then it won't respond and make antibodies. Said limited experience was 18 months before re-immunising, but it was a completely different condition.

Also, different chemo regimes may have different effects, so the recommendation may be based on Dickie's protocol.

Personally, I would want to be certain that my dog was relatively fit before immunising, but I also know that the conditions which we are trying to prevent will also be more harmful should they develop while he is immunocompromised.

I realise that this isn't terribly useful, but it is quite likely going to be an individual assessment.

X Mary

[gilli176]

We had the same thing with Dizzy her boosters were due during her chemo and she couldn't have them as the immune system is weakened we have actually left it a year and this thread has reminded me we should ask about having her vaccinated again.

[Nettie]

Sam if he was vaccinated only a year ago then he should be covered for core diseases for another 2 years. Leptosporosis should be done every year.

Here is the full study by the Veterinary Medicines Directive, hope its helpful to you:

www.vmd.defra.gov.uk/pdf/vaccines_VMDpositionpaper.pdf

Part of the summary:

Summary
1. The VMD recognises the continuing interest within the veterinary and general pet owning community on the frequency of vaccination and the level of protection afforded by vaccines for companion animals. There is increasing scientific evidence that modified live vaccines (MLVs) for the core-diseases as defined in the WSAVA Guidelines, canine distemper (CDV), canine parvovirus (CPV) and canine adenovirus (CAV) may provide a longer duration of immunity than currently indicated on the SPCs of authorised products. The VMD will continue to work within a regulatory and scientific framework to ensure that re-vaccination intervals are supported by robust data.

2. For the majority of UK authorised dog vaccines the re-vaccination interval for the core vaccines canine distemper (CDV), canine parvovirus (CPV) and canine adenovirus (CAV) is at least every three years. These authorised re-vaccination schedules are in accord with the WSAVA Guidelines which state “not more often than every three years”.

3. The VMD sees no conflict between the APVMA position and that of the UK and other EU regulatory Agencies. The APVMA recognises that in most cases core vaccines need not be administered any more frequently than triennially and that even less frequent vaccination may be considered appropriate. For most UK MLV vaccines for dogs, authorised re-vaccination intervals are at least three years.

4. The duration of immunity of some vaccines is relatively short, with re-vaccination schedules of one year or even less. Annual vaccination with some vaccines may, therefore, be required where a particular animal is at risk of infection. For leptospirosis, a serious endemic disease in dogs and a zoonosis, annual vaccination may be recommended by most veterinary surgeons to ensure an adequate level of protection is maintained. Leptospirosis has a number of wildlife reservoirs and is a particular risk to animals and humans exposed to water contaminated with rat urine.

[Deleted]

One of Dan's meds was a chemotherapy drug & he wasn't allowed to be vaccinated with any live vaccines. He had lepto (which wasn't) but the others weren't done.

[andywillow]

Roy hasnt been vaccinated at all.

[julies]

Ask your vet what the drug manufacturers say - I think you'll find that they tell the vet to only vaccinate healthy dogs - which will answer your question

J x

[allthehounds]

We live in France and Mou's vaccinations including rabies were due just before her last chemo session. We asked her osteopath and oncologist if we should wait for a few months after the chemo was finished and although they both agreed it wasn't an ideal time for her to have them done we had no choice as it's the law in France to have annual vaccinations and there aren't any exceptions! We went ahead and had them done and I have to believe it was just a horrible coincidence because two weeks later the cancer was back in her spine and she never made it to her last chemo appointment as we had to let her go. I'll never know if Mou having her boosters contributed to her death but as you don't have the same laws in the UK, I'd say wait as long as you can with your boy before having them done. Hugs to Dickie and I hope he's doing well.

[samburns]

Thanks everyone for so much imput and advice

Nettie that info is really helpful and leads me to think that we should probably discuss with the vet only vaccinating him for leptosporosis - which seems to be the safest and most sensible option and accords with Wanda's experiences with Dan too

Sue I wonder how different Roy and Dickie are in terms of being immunised - although Dickie has had chemo, they are both diagnosed effectively with terminal cancers Is there a concern that the vaccinations are more detrimental to their health than the possibility of them contracting the diseases we vaccinate against? Sorry, just wondering what the advice is (and of course fully understand that in Roy's case it is different because he hasn't had any immunisation - as far as anyone knows - whereas Dickie has )

Allthehounds It just goes to show how laws with probably the best of intentions should involve some discretion - I know you'll never know how, if at all, the vaccinations affected Mou, but I think given the advice here I would be reluctant to go with full vaccinations now Dickie is doing very well thanks - other than having a leg missing you would never know he had anything wrong with him

[kizzeysmum]

The advice I was given was that the vaccinations in an already compromised immune system would be detrimental to his health and possibly hasten the cancer.

[julies]

And check out the Lepto vaccine- its the one that most vets feel is problematical and responsible for reactions .. plus .. if I remember correctly .. there are about 18 different strains of Lepto and the vaccine covers a fraction of them and only lasts for 6 months at best.

Heres the canine health concern link to an article by a vet

www.canine-health-concern.org.uk/Leptospirosis%20Vaccines.html

J xx

[samburns]

I just thought I would share our decision on this issue having seen our vet tonight, for the benefit of anyone who might see this thread in the future

There are a number of factors that have influenced our decision which are personal to Dickie's situation:

Dickie is a nine year old greyhound, he has been with us since he was five and has a traceable history of regular boosters having raced prior to coming to us. Accordingly he has a history of vaccination and at his age, hopefully quite good immunity. The 'core' vaccinations should last for three years, he had a booster a year ago so we don't think all things considered that it is necessary to vaccinate him (for distemper, parvo and kennel cough).

The chemo he had - carboplatin - does indicate lowered immunity and possibly some lesser protection in terms of the vaccinations he has had. We are nevertheless, in Dickie's circumstances, content that he should have fairly good cover from the vaccinations he has had in the past.

The only question we therefore debated at length was whether we should vaccinate solely against Lepto. My understanding discussing this with our vet, is that the Lepto vaccination is advised annually because it is not known how long the Lepto vaccination lasts for....therefore he *may* (with a history of vaccination) be covered for Lepto. Equally, he may not be - hence the advice to vaccinate annually. There is little scientific evidence as to whether vaccinating may accelerate cancer.....we, personally, are not ruling that out, and neither could our vet

So, for us it was a 'risk assessment' as to Lepto v cancer

Our environment plays a big part in our decision here. Lepto is (or at least this is my understanding) associated with rats and where they urinate - canals and standing water in particular - it is also associated with cattle, and the farmland they are kept on. It is also potentially carried by dogs. Our vet in seven years at our practice has not seen any Lepto cases. In his previous practice a few miles down the road, he had one case - whereby the dog had been badly bitten by a rat (and had never been vaccinated and sadly the owners didn't seek treatment until a couple of weeks later when it was too late ). We don't walk Dickie in areas by the canals or marshland around here very often (once of twice a year!), and will now avoid those rare walks. We don't walk him on farmland, nor does he go off lead and wallow in standing water areas or ever swim in rivers or canals where Lepto is more likely to be present, so all things considered we are opting not to vaccinate him against Lepto.

I've found it interesting and helpful to read others' experiences on here, have probably come to the same conclusions in a roundabout way and have learnt so much by being able to ask the right questions, so thanks everyone who has contributed

I don't think its a black and white issue, many grey areas in fact, and imagine its one of those things that everyone needs to consider for their own dogs' circumstances