Advice for an old boy!

[jamfactory]

Hey guys!

We've had our first adopted hound, Arnie, for nearly a year now. He was 9 when we got him (he was homed after his racing days but his owner sadly died, so he went back into a RGT home in Devon, where we met him!)

He's a lovely ol' thing and we love him dearly, but he's still got his prey drive good and proper! I just wanted to ask some advice:

Generally, he's not great with any other dogs that aren't sighthounds. He won't bark or really make a fuss, he'll just suddenly lunge and snap, on a couple of occasions going for the necks of the dogs (they're not always small and fluffy either, all sizes).

We used to muzzle him every walk, but after about 6 months of children and strangers looking at us like Arnie was a murderer, we kinda got upset and let him walk without it. He's generally fine and I always err on the side of caution, and hold him close as we walk past other dogs, but a couple of incidents recently have kinda upset me and I wanted to ask some advice.

I know he can be great wither other dogs, he gets on grand with my parents Parsons Terrier, and will happily hang out with our friends beagle pup and labrador (even when he first met them on a lead, he didnt really fus about them.)

However this morning, Arnie was walking ahead of me at the end of realtively short lead, like always, and I couldn't see that a lady and her dog were just about to walk round towards us - the first thing I heard was a yelp of the lady's small dog - Arnie had gone for him! I pulled him back, I don't think he did any damage, but the lady was so horrified with me, I still feel so upset about it now. Obviously in a situation like that you cant say "Well hes normally very good, well sort of, it's complicated, he's a lovely friendly dog" but obviously all you can say is "I'm so sorry!!"

I just wondered if you guys have any advice? He's now 10, so realistically is he going to change his behavour? He's such a mellow dog, and is so gentle, but then something like this happens and it really shakes us up! I think I'm going to go back with putting his muzzle on, just as a precaution as he managed to get a cat a few weeks ago when I looked the other way for a split second!

Sorry for such a long post, I just stumbled across this forum earlier and felt instantly better reading lots of other stories, so I just wanted to share my story and see if anyone has any recommendations.

Many many thanks,

- Gav.

[samburns]

I would say definitely keep him muzzled on his walks, for your peace of mind and the safety of any small furries you come across. 

The fact that he goes for other dogs (and cats etc) doesn't mean he is a bad dog....sadly its just that they have been bred and trained to do it and its extremely difficult to undo that impulse.  Its not that unusual either that they will accept some other small dogs like Arnie does but it doesn't mean that he will stop that behaviour when out and about with unfamiliar dogs.

If people look at you strangely its their problem, all you are doing is keeping your own dog safe from his own behaviour.  I have found that it helps in a way if your dog is muzzled that *some* other dog owners will sensibly realise to keep their dogs at a safe distance (although some dog owners are ridiculously stupid and will still let their little darlings come right up where they shouldn't be).  Sometimes it can be an ice breaker too and people will ask and you have the opportunity to explain that your dog is wonderful with people but can be unpredictable with other dogs, most people will relax and end up fussing your dog despite the muzzle. 

As an aside, I just wanted to say good on you for homing Arnie....its awful when they have known a home life and then get returned to kennels and at an older age many really struggle to find a new home for life, so he's really lucky  

Welcome to Gap....if you get a chance please do post an introduction in the introductions section and post some photos of Arnie for us all to drool over

[alexandsteve]

Absolute agree with Sam - there is nothing wrong with muzzling and if people look at you funny, you know your doing the right thing.
Welcome to Gap xxx

[Ted]

All four of my Hounds are not furry friendly. However I took each of them to Bronze level training at a great training establishment in Pontardulais near Swansea, called A1K9. Their attitude was on the training there would be dogs of all types, sizes etc, and for the first 5 minutes and the last 5 minutes of each weelky one hour session all the dogs were allowed off the lead in a very secure large paddock. All the owners were told to stay well back against the surrounding fences. The dogs were all allowed to run loose meet, chase and play with every other dogs. One or two had muzzles on for the first couple of sessions, but had their muzzles removed for the last four sessions. All four of my Hounds, three very large Black Greyhounds and one large White Wired Haired Spanish Ibizan Hound are now excellent with all types and sizes of dogs and their owners. However two of my Greyhounds are escape artists so are always on the lead, and my Ibizan Hound now has to be on the lead as she went completely blind in June 2014. As we have cats and other furries, one person walks his Polecat along our road, I always place them on the lead when taking them out to my Dog Wagon and when we come back home. I also leave their leads connected to their Harnesses whilst they are in the Dog Wagon just in case something like an accident or breakdown means I have to get them all out of the Dog Wagon to safety. Because of cats and other furries plus having four large Hounds I do not walk them around our area, which anyway is very hilly. Swansea has rules stating all dogs must be on their leads whilst walking near public roads. I do not use muzzles on any of my Hounds whilst walking at our walking park or along the Towpath of the Swansea Canal at Clydach and Pontardawe, nor at the RSPB site at Cwm Clydach, Sustrans Route 43 between Ynystawe, Clydach, Pontardawe and further up the Swansea Valley and at Craig-Y-Nos Country Park in the Swansea Valley. Last week whilst on holiday in Pembrokeshire near Haverfordwest I found I was able to walk my four Hounds on the lead at Picton Castle Grounds.

[gazer]

Hi Gav, I can only echo the above.  I have dogs I muzzle when out and about, they are in harnesses and doubled ended leads, one is particularly reactive to lots of things, including some dogs, when she 'kicks off' the other girl 'redirects' to her.  It can look awful to the person walking by, but I use the muzzle, harness etc to keep them under control and safe.
What do people think when they see my dogs, I don't know and frankly I don't really care.  As long as they are safe and not a problem to others then I'm happy.  I have had people say it's cruel to muzzle and 'why don't I take the muzzle off'  well, as you know, it's not cruel, a good fitting muzzle that they can pant and drink well in, is absolutely fine and I never understand folk who resist muzzling their dogs when they really need to, just because of how it looks or how others may interpret it.

At 10, Arnie may always be reactive to other dogs, the problem is once they have started to react, it's not easy to stop, your only real option is to move on as quickly as you can. But if you can get in before he starts then you're in with a chance of walking by quietly, use treats and praise when he is quiet, ignore him and move on when he's not.  You may have to be some distance away from a strange dog before you notice that he doesn't react, if you have to walk round dogs, that's fine, if he stays calm for a period of time, try moving a bit closer next time. Stay as relaxed as you can, it will help you both

Arnie is very precious, I would keep his muzzle on when out, he deserves to be kept safe and out of possible trouble.  You just musn't worry what others may say, be proud to walk him, muzzle and all

Explain that he also likes small children, but he can't eat a whole one

[vickyb]

2 of our 4 are always muzzled and always will be as I just can't trust them and as you found out even having them on a short lead isn't enough. I've been lucky and not had a lot of negativity but I always say to people that they are bred, born and trained to chase, they're a product of man and the muzzle protects them from their instinct. Re dogs I just say that they aren't so good with strange dogs and regarding people I say that the dog to worry about isn't the one wearing a muzzle!
What sort of muzzle do you use? Ours have the really light one with nothing actually blocked in and on black dogs they're barely visible from a distance. The on line gap shop sells them and I can really recommend them.

www.greyhoundgap.org.uk/merchandise/online-shop

[gilli176]

Pop the muzzle back on and if others have an issue with it it's their problem. My erin small whippet cross is very prey driven, amazing with dogs even tiny ones but if she sees a cat she sees red. I've had people shy away from letting her close to their dogs because of the muzzle, but erin adores other dogs, so more often than not she says hello when I've explained the cat hatred unfortunately erin redirects and if she could would bite me. But I havepiece of mind when she's muzzled.
Arnie won't mind his muzzle, it will make walk more pleasant for you if you have piece of mind

[lurchernut]

Dec 2, 2014 4:02:34 GMT -5 vickyb said:

2 of our 4 are always muzzled and always will be as I just can't trust them and as you found out even having them on a short lead isn't enough. I've been lucky and not had a lot of negativity but I always say to people that they are bred, born and trained to chase, they're a product of man and the muzzle protects them from their instinct. Re dogs I just say that they aren't so good with strange dogs and regarding people I say that the dog to worry about isn't the one wearing a muzzle!
What sort of muzzle do you use? Ours have the really light one with nothing actually blocked in and on black dogs they're barely visible from a distance. The on line gap shop sells them and I can really recommend them.

www.greyhoundgap.org.uk/merchandise/online-shop

I thoroughly recommend these muzzles too Much comfier for a hound and not as worrisome looking to people who don't understand why we prefer to keep our hounds out of any trouble that could occur along with all the accompanying stress we would then have over any incident if we are not so worried then we are also not transferring that unease down the leash to our dogs.

And
To GAP . don't forget to add some pics of Arnie

[russd]

Hi, our paddy can be a "bit" reactive .............have to agree with what's been said above, also the gap lightweight muzzles are very good, we always carry pads muzzle with us and if it's crowded or not open so we can see what's coming we muzzle him.
He soon got used to it & it's well worth it for peace of mind.
It can be very advantageous sometimes, one look at a greyhound with a muzzle on and most people tend to take much more notice of what their dog is doing ! Boy, do I hate some owners with small dogs & zippy leads !
(and it puts the local scallys on the back foot as well !)

russ.

[ragsysmum]

I'd definitely muzzle him too. You can always say it's so he doesn't pick up any 'rubbish' that might upset him now he's an older dog. Luckily where we live and walk is very wide open straight tracks so you can see someone coming from far off and take evasive action if you have a dodgy dog. In more restricted situations where you can't see much in advance I'd certainly keep him muzzled.

[vickyb]

In case you've not seen the light muzzle on that's Bod in his - easy to see as it's bright blue!
Because he's a whippet x it's the lurcher size that fits him best and it sits just slightly higher up his nose than Gracie greyhounds does and by the look of that it's been snuffling in the sand!

[thedogpack]

Well done for giving a home to an older dog  

I have had greys for 11 yrs , and up until 3 yrs ago could only give a home to cat friendly hounds because we also had a cat . When our dear cat passed to The Bridge at 18 , we could then open our hearts and home to any needy hound without having to stipulate cat friendly .

Because our previous hounds were cat and small fury friendly , apart from the initial first couple of weeks trial period , they weren't muzzled . However 2 of the hounds we have now have, have a very , very high prey drive , and one is very dog reactive due to an experience in his previous home , so those 3 hounds ( I have 5 ) are always walked with a muzzle on .

Walking a hound with a muzzle on was new to me , and I too hated the looks I got from people and the way they would cross over the road etc . However , I soon rose above that and as others have said , it is better that you keep your hound safe and ' watch his back ' , stuff what people think .

My reactive dog ( who was badly attacked by another dog whilst out walking in his previous home and was returned because of the effect the attack had on his behaviour ) would ' turn himself inside out ' at the sight of any other dog . He would scream and stand on his hind legs and redirect his frustration onto me . Obviously he was muzzled but I still used to get comments from people . He was walked on a harness / head collar , double ended lead and muzzled WAS under control . Just ignore peoples looks and comments and enjoy your boy , walking him in his muzzle so you can relax .

Regards reacting to other dogs , the thing that worked for my boy was not to put him in the front line so he doesn't have to make the decisions . Make sure you are always ' one step ahead of him ', turn him before he has time to react  , teach him " Leave it " and use distraction and reward .  If your boy feels you are in control of the situation he is less likely to react .   . Good luck and enjoy your special boy , muzzle and all

[jamfactory]

Ahh thank you guys - thanks so much for the advice and encouragement!

I muzzled Arnie again this morning and felt so much better for it, that peace of mind, that he'll be safe and other furry things will be too!

I really appreciate your advice and lovely feedback, made me feel a lot better after the 'incident' knocked my confidence with Arnie!

I've also 'introduced' Arnie with a few pics on the forum over here: greyhoundgap.proboards.com/thread/82173/hello-arnie-me-bristol

Thank you again

Gav & Arnie

[Andy & Justine]

We go through phases of muzzling or not muzzling depending largely on how much rubbish our two greys are picking up off the floor - but also the volume of visible cats and squirrels seems to fluctuate through the year too. If we feel it's necessary to muzzle our two, we just get on with it. I know some people can be intimidated by the sight but to be honest, if they stopped and thought, there's no need to be worried by an on-lead dog with a muzzle on. It does definitely make some suddenly find a lead for their little darlings that up til then had been running around with no recall. We've recently fostered a 9 year old grey who's owner also died suddenly and we don't really know her history or how she is with other dogs - we have been told she massively failed her cat test though. As a result, we are walking her muzzled and when out tonight, I was walking her and our Lucy with Andy walking Ben behind and a random stranger had to tell us that our dogs were beautiful and he was looking at Lucy and a muzzled Kylie as he said it. Don't let people's ignorance put you off doing the right thing. Your responsibility is in keeping your houndie safe - it's too great a responsibility to try and curb the ignorance of the general public. Certainly, there's many dogs round by us that NEED a muzzle (and a lead, come to that). You carry on. Well done! J

[lucyrw]

We always muzzle Jackson as he does just what your Arnie does - grabs fluffy things that come too close! He too is great with a selected few non Sighthounds but by no means all. It's a greyhound thing and the best thing to do is use a muzzle, keeps everyone safe and takes the stress and watchfulness out of walks.

We also use a muzzle with Ginny when she's offlead, as she can get a bit nippy and over competitive when running with other hounds, and so we just want to remove the possibility of accidental damage.

I've found more people to be curious than judgemental about muzzles (though obviously there are a few judgemental ppl, but I though rather be judged for controlling my dog than causing an accident!) and often you can just say hello to the people who are staring and they'll ask you about using a muzzle. Normally ends with them fussing the hounds, and I like knowing we've educated a fair few kids in responsible dog ownership