Any advice welcome.....Heidi

[andywillow]

I really don't know what goes on in her head! She is a lovely little girl, don't get me wrong she is a very easy dog in so many ways but has a bit of a problem snapping now and again and I have no idea why!
She comes and stands in front of me wagging her tail and putting her head on my knee then jumps up and curls in a little ball to sleep but if I try to move her, sometimes not always she snaps.
She is now banned from our sofas and sleeps happily in the dogbeds. Today we have been out to Rother Valley country park and called at the café for a coffee. A young girl came over to fuss the hounds and I told her to be careful with Heidi as she gives out mixed signals, i.e. she wags her tail furiously and tries to jump up but then curls her lip and growls at the same time (I am sure its not a smile!!!)
This girl obviously had learning difficulties and just didn't get what I was saying, as we got up to go she went to stroke Heidi and again I told her to leave her, she tried again and Heidi snapped. No harm done but then the girl asked why she had done it and I told her that Heidi didn't want to be stroked and I had already told her to leave her, she did give a warning growl but the girl didn't listen to either Heidi or me.
I will now muzzle her on walks, she isn't a bad girl at all and is so lovely but for some reason she is snapping randomly, I did think I had found the reason when I stroked her the other day and there is a soft lump on her side, but she has since snapped at me when I haven't been near it.

Only had to deal with Joe before with odd issues but his are quite plainly his feet which when they hurt we don't touch, end of!!

Heidi is such a lovely little girl but don't want this to continue, I've already lost a thumb nail when I caught her

[mtbbuxton]

Do all the snaps look the same?  The reason I ask is because both Mayo and Daisy snap at us, usually when they want something.
With Daisy, she sits in front of you staring and if you either ignore her or just stare back without speaking, she pulls her lips back and snaps, but doesn't make a sound.  First few times she did it we wondered what the hell was happening, but it soon became clear it was one of her ways of inviting play or asking for attention.  That said, when Daisy goes to the Vets, we always warn them to watch her eyes very carefully as she doesn't give obvious signals that she's not happy and has never growled - Daisy goes straight for a bite and means it
With Mayo, he is normally laid in bed when the play snapping happens and he usually groans at the same time as he snaps.  He'll do it if you speak to him but don't fuss him, or if you've been fussing him and stop when he doesn't want you to.  Air snapping is very common in collies and collie X's.  Mayo will growl if he's not happy and if he snaps as a warning, has a very good bite inhibition.  Even if he gets hold of you  he immediately lets go again.  However, if you touch him in his sleep he'll bite properly.  He never falls asleep on us like Daisy does and will always take himself off to a quiet bed for a sleep.
I hope you manage to find out what's going on in Heidi's little head so as to help her lose  any demons she may  have

Moira x

[andywillow]

It doesn't seem to be that she wants anything, she was laid by my side the other day, I was stroking her then she suddenly went for me. She is such a lovely girl and wants to lay with her head on your knee, gives her paw and wants attention but then snaps for what seems to be no reason

I honestly cannot fault her in any other way, she is such an easy dog but obviously don't want her doing this if/when she gets a new home. I certainly wouldn't trust her with young children. Its just the way she greets everyone with such delight, jumps up at them wagging her tail then suddenly snaps.

[deborahburt]

No advice Sue, but hopefully you'll get to the bottom of it soon. she sounds like a lovely little girl.

[greybeard]

Sue - you don't know what she went through before you managed to catch her.You have so much experience with all the foster hounds, sounds like this may be something new?All our dogs were rescues and came with their own problems(and you have more experience than us at this). Kizzie was a whole different ballgame - you know what she's like and how much heartache she's given us.Wild thought but perhaps Heidi was beaten like Kiz - and she chose to fight back in the only way she knew?And now like Kiz she can't believe her luck and thinks it will all end tomorrow?I have faith you can turn her round.Feel very sad at the moment cos our precious little diva is telling us she's getting old and I so hope we made her happy - Cath.

[andywillow]

Dec 15, 2013 14:46:41 GMT -5 greybeard said:

Sue - you don't know what she went through before you managed to catch her.You have so much experience with all the foster hounds, sounds like this may be something new?All our dogs were rescues and came with their own problems(and you have more experience than us at this). Kizzie was a whole different ballgame - you know what she's like and how much heartache she's given us.Wild thought but perhaps Heidi was beaten like Kiz - and she chose to fight back in the only way she knew?And now like Kiz she can't believe her luck and thinks it will all end tomorrow?I have faith you can turn her round.Feel very sad at the moment cos our precious little diva is telling us she's getting old and I so hope we made her happy - Cath.

Aww Cath, I am sure Kizzie has had a great time with you, she got a chance not many would have given her and she has come so far.

Heidi does seem so confident in so many ways but then in other ways she panics, she is now managing to eat in the kitchen with the others at her own raised feeder but is so submissive when I am putting their meals out, she sort of cowers but runs happily to eat once hers is put out for her. She is also a great guard dog and barks like hell when anyone knocks at the door.
She has come on so far with my lot, she was quite scared of them at first but now mingles with them really well as they really don't give a sh*t about her!!

[julies]

Hiya I'd say a thorough health check would be a good start but be sure to include a chiropractic check as vets rarely include that and it can be that our hounds have a spasmed muscle or other tweak that 'catches' them occasionally and they blame whoever is touching them at the time ... a friend's Mum had her face savaged by a collie she leant down to stroke when at the owners house .. turned out the collie had a tumour in its spine and it must have really hurt when the dog looked up so my friends Mum got the blame

Could also be Heidi is just very scared and the tail wagging like you say is not an 'I'm very confident please stroke me' but a sign of nervous aggression ... good plan to muzzle her- keeps everyone including Heidi safe

Julie x

[mtbbuxton]

Bless her, she does sound mixed up   Actually, she sounds more like a cat in that respect.  I've met many a moggy who's sat happily having a fuss before deciding in a heartbeat that they've had enough and sinking their teeth in  

Come on now Heidi, the good times are here for you

Moira x

[andywillow]

Dec 15, 2013 15:11:16 GMT -5 mtbbuxton said:

Bless her, she does sound mixed up   Actually, she sounds more like a cat in that respect.  I've met many a moggy who's sat happily having a fuss before deciding in a heartbeat that they've had enough and sinking their teeth in  

Come on now Heidi, the good times are here for you

Moira x

She is such a happy girl, mad as a box of frogs on a walk spinning on her lead trying to trash Trevor She is a fabulous little girl, I love her so much but just don't understand her at times and wondered if its something similar to anything anyone had experienced! I really don't want to put anyone off her, she is just an amazing little girl.

[greybeard]

Thanks Sue - that makes me feel better.She still wants to walkies with Kay and Jet and looks forward to it,knows where's she going in the car etc.But now she can't do the full walk - we're still working on compramises and like Kay says we don't want to stop her.But sadly now we really think Chatsworth is too much - bit too far from car.I really hate this - but at least in her own little way she's telling us.Cath

[sammy13]

Bracken snaps when he wants attention. He will mouth and doesn't really do it other than being playful. Sam used to do it as well but it was never a problem. I hope you can get to the bottom of it with Heidi. As has been said it could be something from her past. Hugs to her xx

[greybeard]

Sue I'm sure someone will fall in love with Heidie.You're being honest with her issues - just wish the rescue had been more honest with us.Cath

[Rachel and Daisy]

Hey Sue, I know its a TOTALLY different breed but I am working with a little Chihuahua x at the mo and he has a very similar sounding issue. He was kept in a handbag for the first two years of his life and goodness knows what other treatment he received. When I first met him 9 weeks ago he would resort to using his teeth VERY quickly and with very little warning while being fussed or handled. What we have done with him is allow him to choose when he wants a fuss but keep it REALLY brief and positive. Any handling is always paired with a really high value food reward and again kept REALLY brief - below the point at which he has to tell you he has had enough. Nine weeks on and he absolutely craves your fuss now, but again we have kept it brief to prevent him getting above his threshold and keep him wanting to choose to come back for more. Still a work in progress and a while to go yet with him on some areas of handling but its gone from him biting if you touch him at all to accepting a really good fuss and a good degree of handling. Lets face it 2 years in a bag is a lot to undo in 9 weeks - maybe similar to Heidi and with the little Chihuahua we may have to accept that there will always be things to watch with him - you are the best person for the job tho as so blimmin experienced!

[ragsysmum]

Sounds like she could be hurting somewhere or could it be static electricity when she is stroked sometimes.

[loopylou]

Sue she sounds like Barty in some ways. He's never snapped at other people , i.e. strangers and it's not so much a snap as a nip with him and usually for a reason or what he sees as a reason. However for the first couple of months he would be having a fuss after asking for it I might add and just slowly turn his head round a nip .This wasn't very often though, his main time would be if we were leaving the house and using the stair gate and he would make a grab at us , mainly me but occassionally the lads or my daughter. Never Theo, and Georgia didn't come in the same room as him until recently. It was no good confronting him as he would just get really silly and start barking and jumping at us, and charging around , so we have tapped into his incredible greed lol and he now assosiates us going through the gate with treats. Half a gravy bone as he soon gets porky .There are still a couple of situations he will have a pop normally having his feet messed with or being lifted up so he is muzzled if he needs either of those doing at the Vet. Like Heid he doesn't growl he just slowly turns his head around and if you don't stop it then he goes in for the nip. It's hard to work him out . The same with his behaviour around passing dogs , especially if they're running he's very gobby but fine once introduced. I'm kind of used to it though having previously had border collies for twenty plus years and I think this behaviour is down in part to his genes.The thing is like Heidi he is so very loving , quite submissive with our dogs although he has more confidence now.He used to hate being groomed but now lies down cuddled against me and he really enjoys it often dozing off.It's taken about eighteen months to get him to how he is now mainly with food bribes . He's very clever though and will play us like fools to get a treat I really don't have the experience to know what's going on with Heidi but I'm sure given time her issues will lessen especially with you and your Hounds to guide her.I would say it doesn't sound like play/ air snapping which Molly would do all the time to people and it was hilarious to watch as she did it if she felt she wasn't getting enough attention.