It all kicked off.

[jfw]

Hi, I am new here and would appreciate some words from you experienced guys!
I have 3 lovely dogs (grey/lurch), all get on brilliantly at home, no power struggles, no issues at all, very cuddly with each other etc.
But, over the past few weeks if they are offlead running they have had a couple of incidents of bullying, so I am muzzling them always when off lead now and often only let 2 off at a time as this seems to keep them under control, there is no barging etc.
however, yesterday i did this, muzzled 2, let them off, they ran/played well, I called them back, they returned but as they reached me the one on the lead attacked one of them.
When i say attacked, I mean full on, grabbed her by the neck and was locked on shaking her. the injured one was down on the floor screaming (muzzled of course) and thrashing around. even though i had the attacker on lead i still couldn't get her off and it was only when 2 passers by helped that we got them apart. (At one point I was trying to physically prize her jaws open but her strength was unbelievable)
Instantly, they returned to their normal behaviour and calmed down. the injured girl was rushed to vets and stitched up. Thankfully it was the back of her neck, the muscle which was injured, had it have been her throat......well I dread to think.
I can't tell you how shocked/upset i am, much more than them, they are all behaving very normally with each other.
So my plan is obviously to muzzle them all when any running is to be done. Also, to try to discourage the one on the lead from getting over excited (By using rewards and doing "watch me" s etc, or using the pet corrector if needed). I only let them off in very safe ares as it is.
I have split up many fights before, over the years, but this really was more like an attack to kill, it was horrific.
Any advice would be welcome, has anyone else seen this? Do you think my plan is the right way to go? The 3 of them have been together for a while without any problems, they are sweet gentle angels usually.
Thank you.

P.S. Please don't give me a hard time, the past 24 hours have been amongst the worst ever.

[Palm]

im sorry and i dont have enough experience to advise you properly but i would say it was caused by them being on lead and the others tearing about so ABSOLUTELY muzzle them - personally i would muzzle them on leash aswell from now on so there can be no reactions to other dogs running or eachother in future.
i have an adorable little whippet who is lovely but has to be muzzled when walking in a pack on lead as she will react to my other two if she gets wound up. they are otherwise very settled dogs.
im sure you will get some experienced advice here and no harsh words from gap members. you are in the right place. good luck x

[Flaperoo]

Gosh jfw, that sounds horrific .

Like Beccy I am no expert either, but I would have thought muzzling when on lead or off is a must until you get to the route of what caused this and then try to solve it. I know it can be difficult and I have lost my resolve to keep mine muzzled always, particularly in the latest bout of hot weather.

I have a very fearful dog, who has on one occasion bitten another(although not one of his own pack). I was advised to go back to basics and start again with him.

What are their ages, are they dogs/bitches what mix? What you are doing sounds like the right thing to me, but I'm sure someone here will be able to give you advice that will help you overcome this problem, not just contain it.

Good Luck

Mary

[lurcherlot]

Firstly to the forum.
So sorry to hear one of your dogs was injured yesterday - I hope he/she is OK today.
The most obvious question is are your dogs all neutered? Also what dog/bitch ratio have you got? I would certainly suggest, as Beccy did. that all of the dogs were muzzled on lead and off, until you've sorted out what's going on.... the on lead dog clearly didn't appreciate the other two having a nice run

[jfw]

Hi, thanks for your words. 2 girls, 1 boy. All neutered. 1 grey, 2 lurchers (grey/saluki/whip?), all under 4 years. (Girl attacked girl) but they really are great friends usually . (infact still are, they were snuggling last night).
I will definately be muzzling whenever we go out, on lead or off, from now on.
I am so upset

[Lisa]

Hello welcome to Gap. Unfortunatly its totally normal behaviour and is frustration aggresion. The dog kept on leash will be whipped up into a frenzy because she is desperate to run with the others. This frustration will build and build and build till they literally pop. Was it the greyhound or the lurcher bitch that was on leash? You have to remember these dogs chase its what they do and watching two others chasing and not being able to join in the chase means it drives them mad.

As said they ALL need now to be muzzled on leash as this behaviour can escalate into what we call re directed aggresion also. Should you be walking and they see other dogs running off leash and get wound up like this the pack can often turn in on itself and attack each other.

The reason the attack escalates is that the injured dog usually starts to scream and again this heightens the excitability.

[jfw]

Thank you for that, it is strangley reassuring to be told its normal! I do feel slightly less emotional about it all now. I will learn and move on. And work on the basic control of the girl who did this (lurcher).
Like all of you, my aim is to give my dogs as perfect a life as I can (whilst not allowing them to become spoilt brats!) so it has been a hard couple of days. I wish I could move on as quick as they all did! Like my Oh said, to them it wasn't personal, just business done and dusted, so move on.
They have all always been great with other dogs they meet, very polite etc, but I will be extra extra safe now and keep muzzled. Only 5 minutes earlier the attacker had been off lead playing with a couple of dogs in the park (playing....not chasing), but after what I saw I don't feel I can trust her now, the only thing which could have made yesterday worse would have been if she'd attacked somebody elses dog!!
Thank you again.

[michele]

Hi JFW,

I'm in a similar position to you. I have a rescued greyhound, who is normal timid placid and very loving. He bit someone in our home the other night. I have been so emotional and upset since. My other half wants to dog to go back, but I want to try and treat jis agression. I've enlisted expert help, and have a behaviourist coming on Monday. But loss of trust is the main thing, my other half has a 6 year old girl, so it's natural for him to be defensive on her fortnightly visits.

I'm muzzling him on walks at the moment, and will if anyone comes to the house, but it's hard to know how to treat him in the meantime, he won't know what he's being punished for now, as it happened 2 days ago.

Good luck with your pack, I know exactly how you feel.

[Lisa]

Hiya Michelle have you considered in the meantime whilst you sort it getting a crate? You dont have to shut him in there just set it up put his bed in it and make it his. What was the circumstances of the bite did the person he bit approach him? If you put his bed in the crate and then keep him off furniture and dont provide him with another bed you can start to teach him in your bed when people visit. This then gives you the luxury of telling people that when he is in his bed they keep away and leave him alone. To help him get comfortable with the crate you can feed him his meals there. Take all other beds up so that its the only one he can use. Once he is comfortable if you do need to shut the door he should be fine.

Most greyhounds especially nervous ones love their crate as they quickly learn they are left alone when in there and see it as a safe space for them alone.