Dog on dog aggression and worries around toddler...

[lorc]

Dear all,

This is my first post, and recently a situation has arisen that is causing me considerable anxiety.

Penny is my beautiful black female lurcher.  She was 4 when myself and my ex adopted her from the RSPCA and she is now 7.

Last year, after 8 years, my ex left me.  I hadn't expected it or anticipated, and I was left broken.  Penny got me through it and was an absolute love.

Last October, I met someone new, who had an 8 month old little boy.  Penny was great around him until he first started crawling. Once, he climbed on her back, she bared her teeth and growled. We've stopped him from doing this since, and are always careful to explain to him how to treat her.  Not to get in her face, or hug her, to stroke her nicely, however, anyone who has had an 18month old child will know that they are curious, wilfull and still learning.  And communication isn't exactly clear cut.

They moved in in May, and I've noticed that Penny has become increasingly aggressive and reactive to other dogs on walks.

With some dogs she knows, she is absolutely fine, however, the number of dogs she will actively bark at, lunge at or growl at is steadily increasing (on or off lead).

Her exercise is still good - 40 minutes before work and an hour after.

I feed her good healthy food, sardines, kibble, carrots, peas etc...

However, the reactivity has been becoming a real concern.

This culminated recetnly in her unprovokedly attacking a dog, not much smaller then herself.  It didn't display any aggression.  She ran full pelt from 30 metres away, and was on it in a flash.  This was a dog previously she had played with.

I didn't find out until a week later, she had bitten this dog, which required veterinary treatment.

My girlfriend (and indeed myself) are now concerned about how Penny and our toddler may interact, and my girlfriend in particular (who loves Penny) is now very nervous and scared of the possibility of Penny turning on our boy.

I'm taking her for a T4 thyroid test, but I need to look at the possibility of rehoming her.  It breaks my heart to think of it (and I cried for much of the weekend), but ultimately, it's not fair on Penny if I can't provide her with the attention she requires, and the peace of mind she needs to be happy.

She may be feeling left out, and unfortunately, I can't see how to rectify it.

I'm out at work all day, she is never destructive and has a lovely temperament in the home, but he reactions to other dogs is becoming more than alarming.

Any advice please?

And please try not to judge me - this was a situation beyond my control (I didn't ask to get dumped, and I couldn't refuse the offer of a happy life with my new girlfriend and baby).

Thanks,

Lorcan

ps - I'm in Blackburn, Lancashire, and Penny is such a lovely dog.  I just want her to be happy... x

[kamkay]

I have no advice, but just wanted to say that people on here will not judge you. What they will do is offer help and advice where they can. It sounds like you have a difficult situation to deal with and are dong your best to achieve a happy outcome for everyone involved.

[lorc]

Thanks Kamkay. The situation is about to be exacerbated by the fact that my partner has just got a part time job, down from a full time job, so Penny will now be around our little boy 2 extra days a week, and my partner is becoming increasingly anxious about the situation (and any (unlikely) potentially terrible outcomes)and it's her who will be mainly dealing with the two of them whilst I'm at work...


I had wondered in the meantime whether to fit a dog gate to our bedroom, and allow Penny to stay in there whilst we sort Bertie out of a night and a morning. She spends most of her days in there anyway, and has her own bed (and more commonly) ours. She is however, used to having the full run of the house...up and down...

[Lisa]

In the meantime yes. Fit a dog gate and allow Penny her own space when the toddler is up and active OR invest in a crate that she can use for resting. I find it much easier to teach a toddler to stay away from a cage than a dog bed or sofa. Penny won't be worried by it she will appreciate the fact she has somewhere totally to call her own with a large warm duvet to snuggle down and be peaceful.
As for the dog aggression things have changed so much in her life and she is possibly feeling rather insecure. She has gone from a peaceful house to a busier house and is not necessarily trusting you to keep her as safe as you use to.

Speak to a good behaviourist. Someone like Jim Greenwood you can contact him via his site below and have him come to visit and work with you to find out where Penny is feeling uncomfortable both inside and outside.

www.jandjgreenwood.co.uk/

In situations like this when you and her are all feeling stressed you definitely need an outsider to come in who is thinking out of the box and give you all pointers.

[Carol 47]

Lorcan, I just wanted to say, that if you go down the track of getting a dog crate, that there are some really new cheap ones on ebay like about £25, and, free postage. My son has only just brought one , and he managed to get quite a large one for that price, so, could be well worth a look . I am sure with Jim Greenwood , that this situation can be soon sorted,as he is brilliant, and, that you will all then feel so much happier , and, calmer in the future .

Carol x

[lorc]

How would she react to being in a crate though for the first time at 7 years old? I wonder if the bedroom option would be better? I also think my partner's concerns (which are justified) might mean I have to look for another home for Penny eventually

Thanks for all your responses x

[Lisa]

Regardless of what you decide in the long run I really would urge you to seek help from a behaviourist in the first instance such as Jim above. If you rehome her you will need to return her to the RSPCA and a dog her age going back labelled as dog aggresive and a potential worry around children will sit there for a very long time and not be a very viable rehoming prospect for more people. This potentially is at best, unrehomable dogs can and are destroyed in RSPCA center kennels but you will be contracted to return her. You need to put the work into getting her through her issues before returning if that is what you do decide to give her the best chance of finding a new home.

[lorc]

That's the tricky thing you see. I wouldn't class her as a worry around children - she's never shown an ounce of aggression, barr the growl as mentioned in the original post. Additionally, it's particular dogs, not every dog by far.

However, the increase in incidence of aggression, and the biting of another dog was the clincher for us in terms of being worried about our child, as it felt like a boundary had been crossed - she went from being what I might be able to frivolously call a grumpy dog, to a dog that had actually attacked another dog. I'm pretty sure she wouldn't do anything to our child, but the tension and overall situation in the household is just becoming untenable.

I had no idea I was contractually obliged to return her to the RSPCA....sigh...what if I found someone who knew their stuff, and really wanted her?

I'll see what the vet says (re: the T4 test), and I've contacted a behaviourist from Warrington, in addition to Jim, as, like you say, I'd like to show that we've addressed her behaviour so that everyone can have peace of mind.

I'm going to put a dog gate on our bedroom tonight, our room is very comfy and she usually spends a lot of time in there whether we're in or out and whether or not she has to be in it or is in it of free will. Like a giant crate. I think she might be a bit put out at first, but after 10 minutes, she'll hopefully be snoozing. Once our little one is in bed, she can hang out with us anyway

Thanks for all your comments and suggestions. I still feel very sad though...

[sharonhigh45]

No advice but just to reiterate that on this Forum nobody will judge you and will try their best to give you any good advice they might have available,I hope that you work things out.

[sassbu]

I think you would all benefit enormously from some outside help, I just have read and reread your posts and it sounds a little like Penny's future is sealed already when its possible she has just lost her way mainly due to some fairly major significant changes that she had no control over.

In my eyes aggression against a dog is a long way from aggression against a baby who she lives with as part of the family and I totally understand that with all the publicity we see these days in the papers and social media, it scares people enormously, I find it hard to believe anymore children get attacked by dogs these days than 20 years ago, if there's research against that then I apologise! But we are exposed so quickly these days to so many more events it's hard not to be scared of everything!

I also believe that no dog regardless of its demeanour should be left alone in a room with a little one anyway, we had our 14 month old grandson to stay this weekend and one of my dogs is extremely unsure of children, and the other pretty solid, but we never took our eyes of any of them for a second and made sure they had a safe space to run too if he was toddling too fast or unpredictably for them.

I am pleading I guess, that you take the precuations advised in the meantime but invest a little back in her by exploring a behaviourist like the one recommended for you all. By your own words, she has seen you through so much, she hasn't much of a chance of a rosy future without that and I personally couldn't possibly give up until I'd exhausted every last bit of help/advice available to me

Good luck, we will do what we can here to support you 

[lorc]

Has anyone heard of Jo Wriglesworth? She's based in Warrington, not too far from here...

trainingpetsinthecity.co.uk/about-us/

Although I've just seen Jim Greenwood is only an hour away!

[sassbu]

Sept 22, 2014 17:05:43 GMT -5 lorc said:

Has anyone heard of Jo Wriglesworth? She's based in Warrington, not too far from here...

trainingpetsinthecity.co.uk/about-us/

Although I've just seen Jim Greenwood is only an hour away!

Not me but I'm not up that way. I have definitely heard of Jim though! His name is very well known in the greyhound and lurcher world, I have been on a group day course with him and he is amazing, he had my grey who was dog aggressive back in those days lying down snoozing whilst other dogs walked round him
I'm not suggesting you go to a group day though, I think you need to invest in some one to one family help in this situation, I truly think there isn't anything that can't be worked through and turned around here with some professional and objective guidance

[deborahburt]

No real advice for you, but just to reiterate what the others have said. Safety first and help her find her way again. As you already know, these dogs give so much to us,it's on us to give back to them too.

Keep us informed on how you get on.

[lorc]

Hi all.

The conclusion is far from sealed, however, there are so many pressures. Our baby's grandparents are now worried, and so are putting pressure on my partner, and Penny's temporary confinement to our bedroom isn't going great. Even though she spends all day in the bedroom of her own free will, when that choice is removed, she just seems to sit on the other side of the door. Our hearts are breaking, but it's an awful situation. She's lovely. I'm still waiting for a reply from Jim Greenwood.

[Flaperoo]

I feel so sad reading this thread. Everyone including Penny are so stressed out . Greyhounds/lurchers are hypersensitive to those around them and now all.the humans are hypersensitive too ~ a vicious circle. A crate in the living room would enable you all to relax. I swear by them when I have had potential fear/anxiety issues with my dogs

I hope Jim Greenwood can help with the long term behaviour and that you all live happily together. As you said in a previous post there have been no incidents with your new stepson, just a bit of grumbling which is normal in the circumstances.

I hope it all.works.out for you all

Maryx